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Post by sandymiracle on Feb 10, 2012 12:12:29 GMT -5
@amber... Addressed? Did you see the statement that was just put out (and is already on the facebook page?)
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Post by hendrimike on Feb 10, 2012 12:14:23 GMT -5
what statement? what fb page? the same statement on the forum that was stickied?
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Post by amadeus on Feb 10, 2012 12:38:24 GMT -5
I see no call for a new political party to be initiated anywhere in the declaration. I see a call for Americans to get off their butts and put some better people into office. The ones that PLEDGE to support the suggested grievances, are the ones that are recommended.
In fact, I don't even see a point 6, but I could swear it was there a couple days ago. WTH?
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Post by karliecole on Feb 10, 2012 13:25:34 GMT -5
Amber - strategy being to back an "anonymous" donor in coercion using both the donors money and the 99D supporters contributions to make the founder resign and take all property of the 99D. What?
Who of the 99% that wants money out of controlling our government would agree with that strategy? It's like PACs or Citizen United crap in micro. Those who have refused to see that should leave.
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Post by karliecole on Feb 10, 2012 13:34:16 GMT -5
Amadeus - there was some earlier ideas in Plan 6 that after discussion and polling on FB were changed. It is possible that older versions are still live in some places on the internet.
Here is the current version:
6. If the grievances are not redressed to the satisfaction of the NGA, delegates reconvene to organize a new grassroots campaign for political candidates who publicly PLEDGE to redress the grievances. These candidates will seek election for all open Congressional seats in the mid-term election of 2014 and in the elections of 2016 and 2018.
Ultimately at that point - if we get to that point - the elected Delegates would convene and determine more about what to do then - difficult to plan that far ahead but it would be up to the elected Delegates.
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Post by sandymiracle on Feb 10, 2012 14:29:32 GMT -5
Point 6 is still there. It's also publicly displayed on the 99% Declaration webpage under "The plan" and is screen-shot and posted in NUMEROUS places ALL OVER the web. Reject it clearly, or be assumed to support it.
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Post by karliecole on Feb 10, 2012 14:35:58 GMT -5
Point 6 can certainly be discussed/changed - but that is what has been discussed and agreed for it to be to date. Here are posted some docs on recent donor situation: www.facebook.com/The99PercentDeclaration
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Post by sandymiracle on Feb 10, 2012 14:36:38 GMT -5
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Post by karliecole on Feb 10, 2012 14:56:05 GMT -5
Point six does not state starting a new political party. It states supporting grassroots campaigns.
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Post by amadeus on Feb 10, 2012 16:15:46 GMT -5
The original plan that suggested starting a new political party was the reason I walked away from the group the last time. I'm against the party, for sure, but the main reason is that the declaration was arbitrarily changed midstream without consensus, voting, or even conversation warning us that it was to take place. It was just changed. I wonder who would do such a thing, after garnering many followers, to just take it upon themself to change something that we all supported without even a mention of it?
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Post by amadeus on Feb 10, 2012 16:18:18 GMT -5
This revised version of the 'threat' to Congress is tolerable, but don't change another word of it without some SERIOUS consultation on the topic.
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Post by peedropaula on Feb 10, 2012 16:22:40 GMT -5
Exactly! I was blocked from the Ninety-Nine Percent Declaration FB page after asking Michael why he was spending so much time and energy rewriting the grievances when the delegates would decide whether they stayed in the petition or not. I thought it was a simple enough question and certainly not negative or threatening in any way.
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Post by karliecole on Feb 10, 2012 16:28:54 GMT -5
Amadeus - consultation on that topic has occurred and can again and is most likely since we really have no idea how things will look by that time.
The grievances have always been merely suggested drafts to get interest and debate going.
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Post by nanettejw on Feb 10, 2012 17:03:36 GMT -5
Sandymiracle - I doubt anyone will take the time to read the emails you posted the links too - but I did and as such I'm posting a few others that came across my computer.... regarding the "Leader" = Michael Pollok and the "donor" - It was obvious to me a long time ago the agenda of MP - but I tried to keep the faith a couple of weeks ago when all this was going down, that the new board had it under control - yet here it is another month and everyone is still chasing MP - I sent an email last night, to the board, that if they didn't retain an attorney (grow a pair) that they may as well give up and give it back to MP.... I was told that an attorney had been contacted (but then I've heard that before too). My point in posting these emails are to support what people have stated about MP in his lack of regard for this effort.
One email not in this thread occurred on 1/23/12 when MP was told that this was an effort to save our country not about making a movie - to which he replied, "If we're not going to make a movie then why bother...." Additionally he was more concerned about a $200K book deal. All the PR for this effort was about him. He excluded any of the PR committee on any of the alleged 'interviews' - he was more concerned about him being filmed by HBO rather then the whole facilitation committee...
In my humble opinion - this was never intended to help our country - only to serve one person's grandiose scheme for his own personal and possibly political gain.
Here are the emails that show the true nature and character of MP:
On Feb 4, 2012, at 12:32 AM, Leader wrote: I will need to see the account documentation he filled out to open the not for profit account in the corporate name before 2-7 if you would like me to release the funds to name. I have to make sure this account name opened is really controlled by and in the name of the NYS corporation rather than RS or some other entity. I await to see the account paperwork. On Fri, Feb 3, 2012 at 2:40 PM, Donor wrote: All, to update you. I just met name at the Phila Credit Union and gave him a check for $6000 as the first of three payments toward the $18,000 Match, as promised. He is opening a name of company account with that check and it will clear. The other two payments/remainder of the Matching funds will be forthcoming, as stated in a prior email, when I receive assurances from the Board of corporate and financial compliance and adherence to procedures and protocols, and where there is respect for, and adherence to, the Group Decision Making Model we have together established for this corporation and effort. I trust that will happen soon, and I have Faith in the Board, the Facilitation Committee, all of you and in this Project. Thank you all for your unfaltering dedication to Creating a vehicle for The Voice of The People. On Sat, Feb 4, 2012 at 3:06 AM, Donor wrote: I will need a sworn Affidavit from You (name of leader), acknowledging the following: That you are formally and officially no longer Treasurer, that name and name have replaced you as acting Treasurers, and that you have no authority or signatory capacity to access any bank account held in the name of The name of company That you will cease and desist from making any public statements under the name of effort. That you will immediately (within 24 hours of date of Affidavit) relinquish control of all the name of effort Facebook pages and public Forums to whomever the Board designates. That upon receipt and confirmed clearance of the Matching Funds, you will relinquish all control of the Paypal Account to name as Acting Treasurer. Finally, that you will instruct name of web manager to allow access to the Website to whomever The Board deems appropriate. If I have this sworn affidavit and affirmation, I will deposit the remainder of the Match money into a Philadelphia Account established by name for the name of effort. And we will give you evidence of the account statement affirming it is set up for use by the NYS entity. The Credit union needed additional information from name. But he has my check for 1/3. The remainder to come when you follow through with the above actions, already stated as acceptable to you in other correspondence, as evidenced by the sworn affidavit described above. You have until Monday at noon. On Feb 4, 2012, at 3:08 AM, Leader wrote: I am not giving you shit. Renege, I don't give a fuck and you can answer to the people! On Sat, Feb 4, 2012 at 3:28 AM, Donor wrote: You won't give a sworn Affidavit because you have no intention of relinquishing control to the Board. As I thought. Predictable. If you think I am putting that Match under your Control, you are mistaken. Let the Board and the FC oversee the accounts and processes and it's done. You will not Swear to what you have already agreed. And that can only be because you have no intention of adhering to your Agreements. But your words are meaningless. My money will one day go to the effort. You have until Monday at noon. And know that if you continue to make public statements that question the Donors intent to follow through, or that in any way damage this Group or the effort, I will pursue it to the full extent of the law. On Sat, Feb 4, 2012 at 3:51 AM, Leader wrote: I will not give you the fucking time of day until that 17,500 is wired to the account. I have already sent the signatory forms to name. Sent: Saturday, February 4, 2012 3:57 AM Leader wrote: And that Grima Wormtongue you got working for you will not be touching a penny of any of the people's money! Got name or whatever the fuck your name is.
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Post by amadeus on Feb 10, 2012 18:20:16 GMT -5
Karlie, these are the facts.
The declaration was changed by someone with the ability to change it, someone with administrative rights to the documents.
There was no conversation about it beforehand, and a couple blocks of people that bitched about it afterwards. That's the whole truth.
You can play the martyr as long as you want, but you are only making things harder for yourself. Give up, while you still have some dignity to salvage, and quit lying about everything that is said in order to perpetuate something that will never happen. He's gone, good riddance. It wasn't his idea to begin with, it wasn't ours to share while he was here, and the evidence is overwhelmingly in our favor.
It has nothing to do with a donor, it has nothing to do with money, it has everything to do with him being an armhole in the way he treated the people that supported, donated, and worked to increase the popularity of the project. Lies, deception, and manipulation were the tools of his leadership. As long as he got his way, everything was peachy keen in his mind. When it wasn't he simply deleted the words, but never the truth. He refused to listen to the warnings, as you do now. You are just as guilty in your suppression of free speech on these pages that the group has funded, and now you think that someone actually gives a damn what you think when you take the time to type. Hah! Good luck with that one!
(This is where you say, "but, but, but, that doesn't make it true!")
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